Zen, in honor of Shang Li...

[KonThaak]

As Hannah posted a dedication to Shang Li, I wished to post something in his honor as well... I'm starting a thread dedicated to zen stories, something Li-sensei did while he was alive.

Anyone and everyone is free to post their own Zen (or Zen-like) stories. They don't need to relate back to Buddhism, or even any religion in general. They can be of a general philosophic nature, or of a more personal "I-spat-out-my-toothpaste-in-shock-when-I-realized-X-about-the-universe" style... Jokes and anecdotes on the subject are also welcome, as humor should hold a special place in philosophy along with the more serious subject matter.

I should warn you all that I'm not very good at Zen... Whenever I read Li-sensei's posts, I was always left with the unnerving feeling I didn't quite grasp what he was getting at. Nevertheless, I enjoyed reading them, even if I didn't always agree with the morals.

***

A man had lost his job. He had a wife who couldn't work, because they had children in the home. Money was running tight, and he was having no luck finding a new job...

On one occasion, he saw a much younger man, homeless, begging for food or money... He had nothing to give the young homeless man, so he went to a store and snuck a pack of hot dogs out, and gave them to the vagrant. "I know what it's like," he told the young man...

Despite the good nature of the deed, the man was still racked with guilt over his theft... He went home, saw to it that his family was fed, and had nothing, himself, so the food would last longer, and to pay for the food that was stolen...

When next he saw the young homeless man, he had become a volunteer for a charity drive. The youth told him, "I know what you did, and I was very deeply touched. You didn't have a job; you could have kept the food, and I'm sure you could've used it. I've lived as a thief for several years, now; it's time I gave back what was taken and squandered..."

The story may not be entirely realistic, but the truth in the story is that one man's actions can directly affect another man's life, for worse or for better...and the further one man bends himself to do a benevolent deed, the greater of an impact it can have on the recipient of that deed.

[Kei Nakamura]

A young man once asked a great old master "What is the meaning of life?"
"When hungry, eat, when thirsty drink, when tired sleep" Was the old man's response.

[Ron Caliburn]

That was Zen, this is now.

[Michael T]

Ron, do I even need to say it?

[Shadowstalker]

Yeah you do have to say it Michael.

[A. Pendragon]

"Dream as if you'll live forever. Live as if you'll die today."

[Ron Caliburn]

I'm interested in hearing it.

[Michael T]

I think you have learned from Shang Li well, that was almost a crack he would have made to prove that a proverb can come in many forms. I could be wrong and he may have just smacked you on the head for the bad crack.

Michael T.

[Ron Caliburn]

I rather doubt I learned much from Shang . . . he just provided some interesting context for the lessons life was dishing out.

[Kei Nakamura]

I belive that is the goal for someone trying to spread zen, not to teach, but to provide context so that life teaches.

[Ron Caliburn]

Hrmm ... not sure I came away with the lessons he was hoping for though.

[KonThaak]

The following is copyright the Moody Blues, but I think it fits quite well...

***

After he had journeyed, and his feet were sore,
And he was tired,
He came upon an orange grove, and he rested,
And he lay in the cool,
And while he rested, he took to himself an orange,
And tasted it, and it was good.
And he felt the earth to his spine, and he asked,
And he saw the tree above him, and the stars,
And the veins in the leaf,
And the life...and the balance...
And he saw magnificent perfection,
Whereon he thought of himself in balance,
And knew he was...

And he thought of those he angered, for he was not a violent man,
And he thought of those he hurt, for he was not a cruel man...
And he thought of those he frightened, for he was not an evil man...
And he understood. He understood himself.
Upon this, he saw that when he was of anger or knew hurt or felt fear,
It was because he was not understanding,
And he learned compassion.
And with his eye of compassion, he saw his enemies,
Like unto himself, and he learned love...

Then, he was answered.

Just open your eyes and realize the way it's always been...
Just open your mind, and you will find, the way it's always been...
Just open your heart, and that's a start...

[KonThaak]

That was always my favorite, but you stopped listening to it... Guess you had better things to listen to...

[KonThaak]

Gabe, where the hell are you...?

[concrete_Angel]

"Eyesight to the Blind", huh?

[Eilonwy Solstice]

Thanks for posting it, Josh. It was very beautiful.

[Kei Nakamura]

KonThaak, I would be very interested in finding out who wrote the song, as his understanding of buddhist teachings, from which zen sprang. I know the mechanics, and the origins if people are interested. I fear I do not have the eloquence, or the subject matter to do much more than repeat by rote. Unless that is we talk about teh bio-chemistry of meditation, and the origin and historical spread of bhuddist and or zen teachings.

[Kei Nakamura]

How many of you actually knew Mr. Li, and what would it take for me to arrange an individual meeting with you?

[GhostSpider]

I only briefly met him, so I can not claim to have actually known him. Still, everything that I have seen points to the fact that he was a profoundly wise and insightful individual. It was an honor to work with him, even if only for a short amount of time.

[Shadowstalker]

I met him several times, but I did not have the chance to take him up on his offer of tea and conversation. Thou He did tell me of a few tales from his past, when we had a chance.

[KonThaak]

I'd like to get to know him more... He always made me feel more like myself on the few chances we got to speak.

Also, Kei, I'm sorry I missed your question on this thread earlier... The song was written by the Moody Blues, more specifically by the poet of the group, Graeme Edge.

[Ron Caliburn]

I only met him after he died. We exchanged many messages.

[Chen Lung]

This one's not zen, its Taoist (I was raised Taoist not buddist), but here it is anyway: Chuang-tzu once told a story about two men both of whom had lost a sheep. One of them became very depressed and lost himself in drinking, sex, and gambling to try to forget his misfortune. The other decided that this would be an excellent chance for him to study the classics and quietly observe the subtleties of the world. Both men experienced the same misfortune, but one man lost himself because he was too attached to the experience of loss, while the other found himself because he was able to let go of gain and loss.

[Eilonwy Solstice]

Mr. Chen did you ever know a man naming himself Shang Li?

[concrete_Angel]

You know, that story never said whether they actually DID forget their misfortunes. For all you know, the one guy hit the jackpot, and bought a flock of sheep.

[GhostSpider]

[Chen Lung]

I regret that I did not have the pleasure of ever having met your much beloved Shang Li, but I can tell that I am the lesser for it.

Perhaps the gambler did find his fortune in his losing himself, but was he a better man for it?

I guess I like that story so much because I have turned to the classics and the classics of other cultures and yet I cannot let go of my own gain and loss. I seek to find the same peace as that man in the story.

[concrete_Angel]

Screw that! You can never find peace in yourself, because you're still limited by yourself. At the end of the day, you still gotta end up being yourself.

[Cybermancer]

[Robyn]

There is a piece of wisdom that Cybermancer is fond of sharing, although I don't quite understand it as well as he does.

There once was two bulls on a top of a hillside. One was a very old bull and one a very young bull. Below them was a maginficent herd of beautiful cows.

"Let run down this hill and each mate with one of those cows." Said the young bull.

"No." Responded the wisened bull, "let us walk down and mate with them all."

I'm not sure if it's Zen, but for the number of times that Cybermancer relates this parable, I am certain it holds some wisdom.

[Hannah]

Hi Robyn,

I think that the cow would rather the bull walked up to her and mated with her and only her, but after he took her out to dinner, brought her some flowers and got married.

Hannah

PS: Okay, well real cows don't know or care about that, but those aren't real bulls either, they don't talk anything like that.