Human Potential

[Hannah]

Hi Everyone,

Saw this story today and it got me thinking about what the ultimate potential of the human race is.

Through the society I know people who can conjure fire with a thought, use the force of their own will to move objects and channel personal energy into healing themselves and others.

All are spectacular but I was wondering about something a little more physical. Just how far we can take our bodies.

I've always been excellent at sports, a trait I inherited from both of my parents and honed in high school. I just missed the cut to make it on the US Archery team headed for London this summer, but I was also low balling myself. Last thing I need right now is my face on TV.

I know my father, when properly motivated, has performed some incredible feats of endurance, like lying several hours in icy water without catching hypothermia or suspending himself underneath a bridge by his arms and legs for a night. I've seen Willie long lift cars (yes the plural is deliberate) and Ronin snatch knives out of mid air (thrown by Darcy, and she can throw a knife fast enough that it will bury itself to the hilt in a block of wood).

I remember reading somewhere that one of the main differences between us and the other primates is we never mature properly. Our bodies lock into a stage roughly equivalent to primate childhood in which our minds remain capable of rapid learning but our musculature never properly matures. This is why chimpanzees don't have a spoken language, but are able to literally rip a man twice their size apart.

So looking at London this summer I am sure we will see new human achievements in Higher, Faster, Stronger and everything else that gets measured at the Olympics.

What I want to know is, how far do you think we can take our bodies?

Hannah

PS: Not to say I would have made the Olympics if I had gone all out, all of the girls on the team are amazing. I would have had to bring my A game every step of the way.

[Hannah]

It's also interesting in that even a small organic change can radically alter a person's skills and talents.

Hannah

[Cybermancer]

Given the choice between being able to rip a man apart or being able to speak, I think I'd want to be able to speak.

It is true however that a lot of physical capability has been sacrificed in exchange for complex brains and social interactions. It's been a long process, going back at least two and a half million years. So far as the natural world goes, it seems clear that in the long run, strong intellect and societal bonds are a winning strategy. While as individuals we might not be able to compete with a chimpanzee, our ability to cooperate wins out in the end.

Still, people and chimpanzee's are closely related and we follow the same biological rules in our make up. So at least potentially, one would think that we could make similar physical achievements. The building blocks are there, they're just not being used. At least in most cases.

There comes along every so often exceptionally gifted people whose abilities harken back to those of our ancestors. Physical gifts that are well and truly above those that most people are born with. Gifts that they nurture and train to an even more exceptional degree. There are such people who post on these boards. Hannah has mentioned some of them.

And in the second article she links, we see how like the body, the brain is still a very much untapped resource. As developed as it is, it is not used to its full potential. Nor do we fully understand its complexity. Why should a bump on the head unlock such musical talent? Is such potential in us all or just a select few?

Just as there are those who are physically gifted in the world today, there are those whose mental gifts go beyond what most ever achieve. Geniuses, prodigies and savants with either specific gifts (such as musical talent) or broader intellectual capabilities have been born throughout history and exist as documented cases today. But could anyone be a bump in the head away from achieving such cerebral success?

I don't recommend running head first into any brick walls to find out.

Another possibility worth pondering is that along with psychic powers, maybe these other abilities are somehow an evolutionary response to the supernatural that invades our world? Just a thought. There doesn't necessarily have to be a link in this instance. The biology and genetics that are the building blocks for human life are complicated enough without requireing supernatural intervention.

[Hannah]

How about a woman who has turned into a Marathon Goddess?

What is lurking inside of us?

In honour of her father, "Marathon Goddess" Julie Weiss is running 52 marathons in 52 weeks to raise money for pancreatic-cancer research.

Weiss, who is part of the Pancreatic Cancer Action Network's TEAMHOPE, has already reached $100,000 of her $1 million goal.

"And I'm not stopping there, I'm not stopping until we find a cure," Weiss insists.

Weiss' father died of the disease in 2010, just one week before she qualified for her first Boston Marathon.

"I didn't realized how under-funded it was, and what a deadly disease it was," Weiss told Northland's NewsCenter. "I thought, I'm going to do something big and make a difference.

Weiss has already completed 10 marathons since beginning her challenge.

"My body's getting used to this. I'm changing my diet, becoming more healthy and learning to run more efficiently," the Santa Monica, California, runner said.

"When people tell me I'm crazy or nuts, it means I'm on the right track and doing something good."

Her final race will be in March 2013: the L.A. Marathon.

There's a video on the site.

Hannah

[Grace]

What's the big deal? She gets like a week between runs to rest. I could do that, easy peasy.

[Ron Caliburn]

You do realize that training to run a marathon usually means running two or three marathons in the week before along with daily half marathons, right?

By my math this woman runs about 150 miles a week.

[Grace]

I suppose someone who didn't run all the time might have trouble with that.

[Cybermancer]

As fecitious as Nemesis may be, this isn't quite as impossible as one might think. For starters, the human race appears to be evolved for endurance running which may have assisted in early persistance hunting.

There is a group of people in Mexico called the Tarahumara who continue to practice endurance running as part of their lifestyle.

Today the feat this woman accomplishes is extraordinary simply because the rest of us have lost or perhaps more accurately neglected the ability of our ancestors.

So am I saying that Darcy is a throwback?

Well, no one would doubt her ability to hunt.

[Grace]

So that's how it is, wise guy? I thought you were supposed to be smart but here you are, poking the bear. You're lucky you make neat toys.

[Cybermancer]

Here's an usual one. It's called Genetic Chimerism. No, I'm not talking about gene-splicing. This happens in nature, though very rarely.

It is also called tetragametism and occasionally happens in humans. What happens is two fertilized eggs or embryo's fuse together early in the pregnancy. Each zygote carries a copy of its parents DNA and thus a distinct genetic profile. When these merge, each population of cells retains its genetic character and the resulting embryo becomes a mixture of both. Essentially, a human chimera is their own twin.

This only happens very rarely, with less than a hundred human cases reported. This can complicate parental DNA testing for children of such a Chimera, as samples taken from blood may not be a genetic match for those taken from other areas and children can potentiall inherit the DNA profile of either 'side'.

Aside from being able to confuse DNA tests, Chimera's also have the advantage of being more tolerant to foreign genetic material. This means they have a wider range of acceptable organ donar candidates. It can also lead to the chimera having sexual characteristics from both sexes, though this is not necessarily the same as being a hermaphrodite.

Here is an interesting theoritical aside. Fraternal twins occur when two eggs are available for fertilization at the same time. Usually these eggs are fertilized by the same father. In rare cases, each egg can be fertilized by different fathers. This is called heteropaternal superfecundation and is fairly common amongst cats and dogs and can occasionally happen in humans.

What this means is that two eggs can be fertilized by two different fathers and then those fertilized eggs can fuse, resulting in a child with two fathers.

I don't know of any cases of this actually happening (one child with two fathers), but it would be an interesting case to study if it were to happen.

[Natasha]

Not to sound flip or like Kolya, but if you're not going to talk about the paranormal or the supernatural, then the limits is the same as the limits of physics. To truly push the limits, so to speak, I think you have to follow the "water bends the oak" proverb. Like the eastern body hardening exercises or far less exotic or painful: going to the gym.

I do not think it is so much that we do not mature properly as much as it is we mature differently. Our genetic make up is similar, yes, but we are still not chimpanzees and chimpanzees are still not humans. For instance, human jaws lack certain proteins found in the jaws of other primates that explain why our jaws are weak and the others are more powerful. There are biomechanical differences, too. A chimp has a lot of his mass in his shoulders, back, and arms which helps him climb and tear apart monkeys (but the magnitude of chimp strength is an overstatement resulting from poor science many, many years ago). His arms remind of our legs, which are more power than our arms generally speaking (and I'm a perfect example of that).

[Ronin]

Not to sound flip or like Kolya, but if you're not going to talk about the paranormal or the supernatural, then the limits is the same as the limits of physics. To truly push the limits, so to speak, I think you have to follow the "water bends the oak" proverb. Like the eastern body hardening exercises or far less exotic or painful: going to the gym.

As to the question of what eastern training can accomplish, if you are in the USA and especially near New York, I recommend that you contact my sister Daichan. She can leap and perform other feats nearly as well as I can. Alternatively, if you are ever in Tokyo, I would be quite happy to demonstrate my training for you.

No recording devices, please.

[Daichan]

She can leap and perform other feats nearly as well as I can.

Nearly as well my butt, brother. I can do anything you can do and a few things you can't. Just because I'm on the other side of the world, don't think you can talk smack about me and get away with it!

[Cybermancer]

Actually Daichan, if you're willing, I wouldn't mind a demonstration.

Though we'll need to discuss how strict that no recording devices rule is.

[Grace]

Yeah. Find out how she's been cheating.

[Nemesis]

In the Foundation they used various types of trauma to promote the development of traits they felt were desireable.

Much like exercise tears the muscle, allowing it to grow, only.... more so. Of course we were exposed to other things, mystical, alchemical and physical.

[Shang Li]

The body is but one part of the whole.
The mind is but one part of the whole.
The spirit is but one part of the whole.

Each of these parts alone is easily tested to it's breaking point.
Each of these parts alone is weak.

The spirit without the body has no form.
The spirit without the mind has no focus.

The mind without the body has no strength.
The mind without the spirit has no insight.

The body without the mind has no intelligence.
The body without the spirit has no life.

When Body, Mind and Spirit all strive for one goal, each drives the others beyond their "limits", allowing one to perform feats that most would consider "impossible" - for a price.

When Body, Mind, and Spirit become one, they are no longer human, but divine. This is the buddha within each of us, waiting patiently for us to awaken to our true nature.

[Phoenix]

Only the foolish underestimate human potential.

[Hannah]

You got that right.

Hannah

[KonThaak]

Well, I think it's time I shook off the dust and cobwebs, and started tentatively poking my head out.

I find it interesting that this is the top thread in the Philosophy Corner, which was always my favorite topic here, anyway... I've been going through some very major changes in recent months. They've been affecting me more than I ever imagined. It's given me a lot of unique and interesting perspectives on a lot of things.

If anyone's curious, you can ask, but it's a bit too personal to just blurt out in public, especially since I died some years ago.

Oh, yeah. I'm not dead, by the way. Probably should've said that, first.

Hannah, good to see you again. Your dad still running and gunning?

Have I missed much while I've been out of it?

[Ron Caliburn]

You could say you've missed a fair bit, yeah. Again the most of it is not suitable for public discourse, look to your private messages.

[KonThaak]

I will be eagerly awaiting the update...

[Shang Li]

Welcome back, my friend, you have been missed.

I believe we are long overdue for afternoon tea.

[KonThaak]

Master Li, it's good to see you, again. If you send me a private message, we'll try to get together for that tea, sometime...

[Ron Caliburn]

It's too bad Hannah is out in Montana for the next couple of weeks. I am sure she would love to be chatting both of you up.

[KonThaak]

Apparently, she gets very good reception with her satellite phone. Normally, in my (limited) experience, those phones have really bad phone lag...so I rather suspect there's supernatural cheating involved. ;3

[Hannah]

Not at all. Matt just makes a really great product and we don't have to relay halfway around the world, instead we can just bounce up and then right back down to the ground station.

At least that's what he said was going on.

It was really good to talk to you KT, will see you again in person really soon, I promise.

Hannah

[Daichan]

Getting things back on track here.

There are limits to what the human body can accomplish. Even with help (cheating as Darcy puts it).

The limits to the human spirit are slightly less strict. That is, we all have a bit of the divine in us and our ultimate potential is unlimited.

So do not worry Mel, if your attempts at fencing resemble a chimp swatting the ground with a stick as part of a territorial display. There is still hope for you and you're still one of god's special creatures.

[KonThaak]

There are limits to what the human body can accomplish. Even with help (cheating as Darcy puts it).

This is very true. However, the limits tend to be much, much higher than anyone realizes. We limit ourselves subconsciously to prevent ourselves from tearing ourselves apart. With some special training (or cheating, too), one can overcome these limits for short times, extending the body's potential almost exponentially. The few times I've done it, I've also noticed a massive increase in my personal energy, which in those moments, I needed...but when I came down from the heavy adrenaline rush, I paid for it.

[Cybermancer]

We are approaching a time when it will be the principles of engineering and not our human bodies that will determine our physical limits. New technologies for rebuilding human organs and limbs are being advanced everyday as are other enhancement technologies such as exo-suits.

It reminds me of old myths where some weapon, talisman, armor, shield or amulet made a hero a match for the monsters they opposed. What will the world be like when we can make an army of such heroes?

Assuming of course we recruit heroes for those armies.